In the course of the money discussion, which was reignited by the plan to buy houses in Wurzen, quite a few yuniteers wrote long personal statements. This page collects them in a chronological order.

The originals have been shared in #wupphouse_planning on Slack.

There has been a lot more talking going on with regards to this topic, most of it in above-mentioned channel, as well as in #money_philosophy and #primary_objective and in the thread Can we share money? on discourse.

Contents:

Frank Onfire

2017-01-24

i want to remind (maybe just myself) what we are actually aiming for. from my understanding the goal always was to "build" A society based on *self-determination* (im not completety da chor with this since i belive society [and everything] is a system in which entitys depend on each other...so an including-us-determination maybe could be a better therm), trust and cooperation which allows people to live to their full potential and to (*preserve ecosystems for all living beings* <-- awesome ). for me this means that we need to change the way we do things. because what we call capitalism, economy or even such "boring" terms like "modern"-agriculture are (in my opinion) on their way to totally wreck this planet as an ecosystem. This needs to stop. It will stop at one point and it is our task to paint the picture that we will face in the end. our future is still unwritten! And we are not alone with our vision(s)! to me i feel like the degrowth-movement is getting bigger increasingly fast. and its not just us being *the only entrepreneurs* in this field. and i personally do not want to lift myself in the sky myself through being a super-radical-moneyfree-person. I personally do not want to promote too radical-lifestyles. i guess an average person from the west will not survive for long after becoming moneyfree from on day to the next and will possibly damage himself, society or the environment due to the fact that this individual is just a sum of what it has been around. You need to change and train especially you mind to do that. I think that you still need to bee part of a system if you want to change it. Im not ready to leave yet! :wink: You will need to know stuff if you what to be self-sufficient. This will take time and maybe several tries.the speed of this transition-process is dependend on soo many things. And will be different from person to person. And it could even be counter-productive if we promote our movement in a too radical and therefore too abstract way for other people to follow. An important question for me is "how can we reach the most people to act more and more preservable and sustainable?“ the environmental impact will be biggest if you for example convince a large amount of people to share 20% of their needs (maybe foods :wink: ) than if you have a small amount that shares absolutely everything they have. Here is another thing that i want to say: i think one can become greedy by wanting less and less and minimizing needs like one can become greedy by wanting more and more. And you can stand still and change nothing by accepting everything like it is or you can make small steps in the right direction without losing focus of what you wanted to accomplish in the end. For me the yunity vision was never about becoming completely moneyfree than the enviromental impact of sharing as much as possible.

[2:58]
Can i imagine to share everything? - no. Is it the always the most sustainable way of acting everytime? - i dont think so! Short example from my expierince? Here we go! If someone decides to use my chlothing after i agreed on sharing and the next day if find it ripped apart and dirty near a fireplace… was that the most preserving way of making use of this piece of fabric? - absolutely not! Did we learn something from this? - i hope so! By the way: the way the person who was involved in this was someone i would consider to be one of the „core-members“ of our group. Nobody is perfect. Im far from that. We are here to learn. Learning (hopefully) will never stop. Therefore i think those thought-experiments and discussions we are on are a good things and i would like to see that we do not stop communication. But i also would like to keep them from inhibiting us too much from realizing what we already agree on. Again – this is a process. A process is a thing that changes. We are steering this big boat together – for yust one or two the rudder is to heavy. i think the wupphouse-project has been trying hard to find a useable building for free and *the race is not over - it has just begun*. For me this project is something that i want to dedicate my life to – so… i dont care too much if it will take us a liiittle bit longer. we will find more places that can be opened to everyone and more people who want to help and join. Sorry if i get something wrong here but didnt for example the dragon-dreaming process teach us that doing and thinking alternates each other and the whole thing repeats itself? So if you understand this in the most negative way we will maybe aquire houses over and over again by using money. This would be the worst case and i do not think it will happen. Because we are aware that this is not the optimal outcome! I belive in second and third chances and a belive in transitions and transfomations. And i think the softer the change will be the more safely it will suceed. As long as it feels like we are still changing to the positive i dont care too much about the speed. Patience!

[2:58]
We did accomplish a lot and im happy that took part of that. i think buying the wupphause could and i belive it will have a much much larger good impact than it will have a bad one because money has been used in the process to get it. the trainstation needs to be almost completely thorn apart and rebuild before it can be used. And after that it is in my opinion still not optimal to be a quiet hackspace or meditaion oasis. It could be used to its most potential if we do events like free movieshows, concerts, or cooking like Vokü and tabletennis. A garden. Weave it into its souroundings and invite everyone to make it accessable in a moneyfree way. We will need a lot of help to make this happen (really) :slightly_smiling_face: - hmm i dont think im finished with what i wanted to say also and especially about wurzen money wupp*breaks* and dopamine but ill try to catch some sleep for now. Cya in a sec. Ty Gn8 :heart:

Paul Free

2017-01-31

Authorized summary by Nick Sellen:

Too many issues are arising without then properly exploring the topics. Decisions get made without proper process. In this way things get done that seem to contradict the principles of yunity, or might do, it is not clear without digging deeper.

A few of the issues have been:

drug use or smoking, esp around local kids
excluding Curtis
not clear working process at Bad Dürrenberg
use of money in a capitalistic way (giving power to the holder)
closed group conversations about important topics

Some people want freedom to do what they want, but this does not lead to freedom for all.

Some people are perhaps not being honest/open about their true intent/motivations for the project.

Original post:

..I’m aware that some people switch in defense once they became confronted. So I want to make shure that this text is not a offensive, but my try to be transparent, open and honest on the process during the last weeks I have been observing.
My main focus here will be on the topic WuppHaus. Before starting I like to state that in many “alternative” cycles non violence communication became status quo. I like non violent communication but not as a unconconcisnous method to opress. In hegomonistic cultures this is the case.
If you interpreat frustration in my lines I’ll honesty need to say it’s sadness. And anger as a way to push away behaviors from others creating this sadness.
The sitation I’m discribing might sound in between far away from myself as I wouldn’t be part of, so I need to tell you; it just sounds like.

How I feel:
- tierd
- sad
- angry

What I’ve observed:

The story of the wupphaus started during a time I’ve not beeing related to yunity. It was chemnitz.
The basic idea was to create a permanent wuppspace.
From this point a couple of conversations have happened. Most of them from my point of view in closed group conversations.
A deeper look into how and why a wupphaus was always rejected. I’ve brought it up a couple of times.
As an answer I’ve heard often that it’s all kind of clear already and that we don’t need to talk.
Well, then we had a talk in neurid, with again no interet in digging deeper. Methods I’ve adviced to use have been rejected.
Then the next meeting have been in Witzenhausen. Also there my advice to go through a deeper group process got rejected. What happened was that we choosed world cafe as a method, without that nealry any of the groups had some deeper thoughts into group dynamics. But what it created was a pseudo consensus leading to pseudo harmony.
Lucky as we have been Bernd reached us and offerd the first WuppHaus. Which is a train station in Bad Dürrenberg.
Bodhi und Matthias have been the once checking out the place and called for help directly after.
From there it bacame very confusing for me.
On the day I’ll arrived I saw people acting around doing many little things….and for me it felt like, wtf, this train station is fucked ^^.
The motivation of the people surprised me very much, as I didn’t acspected from them tryn to be commited for something that big.
But well, I’m very open and fast adjusting my perspectives. :-).
The next days have been very chaotic. At least once per day Bodhi or Matthias where calling the people together to talk about breaking up.
It was during a time there haven’t been anyway enough informations to make any decision on that.
Some days after a view people told they broke up with being commited with the first WuppHaus. ….but still calling others for “let’s break also up”.
Beside that, my critics about drug consumption got ignored. Now there are difficultys to explain little kids that smoking might not be the best. ...but those who didn’t cared about just left.

During the time in the WuppHaus the interest of planning was little. Mostly people where interested in acting. Just as an example I remember Curtis asking many times to have a planning meeting about how to organize the rooms. ...rejected. In the end the kitchen got 3 times moved. This workflow is frustrating. Taking the time to digg deeper before starting….I couldn’t found much.
...beside that Curtis brought a couple of times valid points in the group. Bodhi and Matthias often took the lead of stoping him.
...didn’t make the situation better between you and him of course. ;-)
...but instead of solving the conflict following was happening:
During curtis took a trip (to berlin?) a meeting was called, where Matthias and Bodhi strongly expressed to not want to live with curtis.
All I said during the meeting was that this is not a meeting that should happen without the one person involved. It only showes one perspective of the story without the chance that curtis could explain. These behaviours you could call mobbing.
As an open question: Is this bahavior accepted? If yes I might join the game. I prefer not to.
Also I’m happy to open the space to talk deeper about exclusion/inclusion.
...what I mean with deeper, is also being honest and open about the very own feelings and experience of the past.
I’m not interested in supporting a culture which is about excluding people instead of behaviors.
Inbetween Matthias was thinking of buying/renting a flat for his WG.
Sitation then came different. They god offerd a building in Wurzen for 40.000
Which is fine. ...but not if it is promoted as a yunity projekt.

So I’m asking:
Be honest about you’re personal motativation. If there’s inconsitence don’t hide between nice and friendly words. State what it is, and promote it as it is, at least within yunity. ...and yes there might be different perspectives and I’m happy to be called wrong on mine, if you explain. (actually I would love to be wrong)

Yunity is about encouraging relationships where people share uncondionally….etc.
What does buying a house has to do with this? Well I know the answer framed in your mind already: “because we open then space for others etc.”
There are reasons why people are forced by the economy. There are reasons why people dieing while we have more then enough. There are reasons why people die in wars around resources.
There are resons why people sleep in the streets.
And it’s nothing else then our ignorance that let this all happening. It’s happening if we’re not willing to share. ...might be struggle but also resources.
Our economy system is based on the ideology of trading. This ideology will always bring up hieracys and unjustice. Why? Cause who’s better in trading get most. ...and mostly are these people less interested in society but in themselves. Freedom in this world means to do what you want.
Freedom in my world means to rise up the freedom of each other. And adjusting my needs if they don’t fullfill this.
How could we ever switch the force of capitalism if we always keep on liking it, as soon we have a advantage from it. Not, cause that what it is based on. Advantage for me first.

The argument of the wupphaus is about sharing:
In my logic money doesn’t bring usefull advantage for humanity. But if yes money is usefull.
And if money is usefull why are you buying a house instead of sharing?
For me it seems like this:
“You have through your position of having money more rights then others. You can just buy a house, while others can’t. You have the dream of having a WuppHaus based on your rules. You use your privilidges for your own idea. You’re not interested in sharing it. But, you’re interested to let others part of your idea. This you call sharing.”

I’m happy with having a deeper discussion with all involved. My need for this is a structured conversation, at least when online.
Also I’m happy to go deeper through just having a meeting. ….but until know there wasn’t much interest for.
While I like to be honest:
I won’t let this conflict pass until solved. When this conflict is solved 2 things might happen.
I leave yunity or you keep business out of yunity.

...when the first will happen that would be something kind of funny. ^^
Raphael just made some month ago by the essence the same proposal like you’re now just pushing on the group, without asking for advice...or wait, asking but disrespecting, to some extend ignoring, and not interested in digging deeper.
The group decided to keep yunity on the principal of sharing. Which made Raphael to leave.
...now you may make those to leave interested in sharing instead of trading.

(this is ankering, as many of us do unconscious when we try to convince each other instead of understanding. I prefer the last one but join both games.)

I will leave 2 weeks time to start engaging. After I will start a syscon.

Lara Earthling

2017-02-02

https://bin.disroot.org/?ec353a6caccf613a#a/pXIADrP1csxcn7mrH7jx67FNYpyCJmvsEu21oGPvs=

Matthias Larisch

2017-02-03

The story of my life related to feelings, needs and visions on a WuppHaus/WuppSpace

To contribute to solving the ongoing conflict about the WuppHaus situation, I would like to express my feelings, needs and visions about the WuppHaus but as well as my activity within yunity (and maybe my whole life) as I see all of this very connected. I will begin with an introduction of myself to deduce my needs and personality. Every chapter includes a TL;DR in the end to allow a shorter read, because this text got a bit long...

How I grew up

I was raised as a single child, did all the "normal" life stuff. My parents always made a lot possible for myself, I never had any money issues. This was because I was always aware with what I did with money, maybe more on the "economic" side of things than the ecological one. But also I always had enough money for whatever I wanted to do. With getting older and studying, I also got aware of how fucked up our planet is, I learned about global connections of producton chain and product life cycle. My ethical rules for whatever I did - in terms of working and supporting - have been quite strong, at least in comparison to the people around me. I have been tangentially involve in the hacker scene since I was approximately 12 years old. I have been doing server administration work, wrote some widely used (but now long forgotten) software for a GalaxyWars clan in approx. 2003, rebuilt electronic projects, organized lan-parties, developed my own microcontroller projects beginning in 2004, organized parties in school, knew how approximately every technical device in my range worked internally in detail. From 2000-2014 I spent approximately 5000 euros for electronics stuff - mostly components but also some tools or services that enabled me to spend a huge amount of my free time in the electronics workshop in our basement and gain a lot of knowledge as well as have a lot of enjoyment. Finally studied computer engineering and enjoyed it (mostly). Had some nerdy-friends (not used to many people with the same fields of interest around me earlier) beginning at that time, started a lot of "cool" (but not useful) projects, most never got finished. Doing paid work got harder and harder for myself: I noticed how I lost motivation although I mostly liked the tasks. I missed self-organisation and scheduling. I think I also mostly just worked on things because I felt like - I did not always have the intention of making use of the product, so mostly the product was never finished. This is different, when someone expects results :-)

**TL;DR** single child in normal, middle class parenthood. Childhood consisted of technology, computer, some friends. Would include myself in the hacker community and still like this very much. Gain motivation by freedom and curiosity.

My start in foodsharing and yunity

In 2014, I got to know foodsharing. Within a month, I met Raphael Fellmer, Raphael Wintrich and more or less anyone who was there. Through contacts initiated through foodsharing, I got to know about a world with different people: People trying to support each other, to live together. To work together towards any goal instead of working against each other, instead of comparing everyones contribution. People, who love and support each other. A world, where showing love and affection to a lot of people is not only accepted but appreciated and returned. Dealing with other people, it was common to have a very low perception of property and ownership. I noticed, that I enjoyed just being around people a lot more than ever before. I liked what I experienced there, quit my job, quit my flat, flew to venice to be able to participate in the first WuppDays from day 1. Everything fit perfectly. The experience was great. I remember the first sentence Philip spoke to me: "If I would kiss you now, you would never forget me again" (or something very similar - fyi, he didn't, still, I will never forget) I can't really tell what made me go to the first WuppDays in Malo, but it was partly because I expected to meet great people there as well as work on a software project that could have the possibility to change the world. The vision of yunity fastly expanded further than I could imagine. It is all about sharing. If you share, what you don't need, it will not be wasted. Expanding this to not only share leftovers but everything became somehow the motto of yunity. *

*TL;DR** Got involved into foodsharing development quickly after starting foodsharing, really liked the people throughout the whole network as I never met similar before. Liked a more relaxed handling of property, got introduced into sharing

What is yunity?

What is yunity? This question arose in the last months in me and is getting stronger and stronger. In the beginning, yunity was started as a software project. After the first WuppDays, yunity was already much more than this. In mid 2016, the software project vanished. With it, also my clarity about what it really is. Still, I liked being on the events. It became clear, that yunity is still a network, but a lose one. Projects could see themselves as a "yunity project", there was never a decision nor a fixed group to be seen as "the yunity group". One thing was always clear for me: Yunity has always been open. Very open. I really like this, although it normally is just too much for me. I enjoy being around people in yunity in general, but sometimes there might be situations where I prefer escaping instead of going into deep conversation or conflict. In my whole life, I never enjoyed long talks about things that are not fact-related or don't touch my field of interest. I still notice that this is true, although I got a lot better at enjoying some stories as well :)

**TL;DR** started as software project, lost clarity after, got a network and umbrella for different projects. No entity that defines what projects there are -> open

Yunity is open

What being open for yunity means was also that we were open to different kinds of lifestyles. The way yunity was created, we invited random people with interest in making the world a better place. Those people came. From different backgrounds, different skillsets, different lifestyles. People flying on airplanes multiple times a month to people hitchhiking their whole life. People living moneyfree as well as people earning 100k dollars a year. They all came, because they liked the concept of what was happening. The spirit of every WuppDays was very special: The events always were kind of self-organized - some people cared for an arrangement to get space and some other individuals added more things (like organizing a connection to get coal for heating, getting material to use, getting local people who help us out, organizing inviting events, etc.). There has never been a common entity that cared for all this, each of us was equally enabled to do whatever felt fitting.

**TL;DR** yunity attracts all kinds of people because of the concept, spirit and freedom. Self-organized events.

Yunity and money

Talks about money shew the need for a solution in the group. It was voted, to basically leave everything as it was anyway done before: Each individual can use money to buy things if they see a need, but the group itself will stay moneyless. For the first WuppDays, the group got gifted some money which was kept and for example used for buying coal in Chemnitz. One can say, that this money was handled by individuals but effectively used by the group because it somehow belonged the group. Did anybody care? No. Because nobody saw a problem at that time, people were happy that we could have warm rooms also in Chemnitz.

First mention of WuppSpace

That was also a time, when the idea of the WuppHaus evolved. I remember Bodhi, Doug and me first thinking and discussing about a place, where basically endless WuppDays could go on. This was a) because each WuppDays took quite a lot of effort to organize and b) Big parts were always the same: We got some "fucked up" space in some building, made it fit our needs, used it and left again. How ressource saving would it be, to create the perfect place? We have common visions regarding different core concepts of a house, like energy and water usage and concepts, but also about functional room arrangements etc... I myself always had the wish for a place I would mostly use for working in the fitting athmosphere, so having the right kind of rooms available. Having nice people around myself, like the people that were in yunity at that time (but also the people who are involved in yunity now), was also a very attractive point. Since I am with the yunity project, I cannot imagine living in my own or a shared flat anymore. I feel so much better living in a community arrangement with people with similar values.

**TL;DR** Permanent space (like WuppDays) to safe effort/resources; implement more complicated ideas; having a base; communal living instead shared flat

My needs/visions of a WuppSpace

I remember talks with at least some people, where my own interest and thoughts were always about "let's buy a building, make it nice as a WuppSpace". My own needs of a WuppSpace: - having silent working rooms to work on a computer in a nice, bright, not too crowded room - an electronic workshop where I can help people repairing also advanced electronics and also work on my own projects and inventions, e.g. to build cool electronics around the house - also the general workshops you need to fix things around the house and build other cool stuff - having proper, professional grade tools in the workshops (tools that do the job well) - communal sleeping areas - common clothes drawer - proper sanitary equipment (e.g. comfortable compost toilets, nice & warm showers) - nice kitchen that makes cooking & cleaning easy - ecological solutions e.g. use solar/wood heated water for washing machine etc. - comfortable solution for washing & storing dumpster dived food - having very relaxed views on property inside the building/community These needs have not really changed at all since my first thoughts about them. I always wanted that place to be open but also see a limit in openness (e.g. the need for a little bit more closed community area to be able to have a safe space). ## Expectations what happens inside WuppSpace: openness, money At first, it was also really clear to me that living or using the WuppSpace was still open to anyone without any implications. While the main purpose should always be to work on yunity-alike projects, I would never have seen a problem when I would for example spend 2-3 times two weeks a year working on some kind of commercial project(aligned to my values). I would have never seen a problem if that house would generate costs from 10-20k euros a year (because I always thought we could do much cheaper than the general population but I would never try to attempt a "zero" approach). On 2016-01-10 I stated the use of money in our survey as follows: "Miscelanious small things (e.g. Python stickers, light-bulbs, etc), Additional Costs for a temporary or permanent WuppSpace (water, gas, electricity, insurance etc.), Personal medical insurance, Would consider any expenditure on a case by case basis, All costs that apply (e.g. using any resource that is neccessary for convenient wupping and not easily available rescued or sponsored)" For me, the WuppSpace was always about having an effective as well as efficient space to express yourself and do what you like to do. I saw the space as a tool, not the way to it as a goal. Tools need to be good to provide efficient working with them. If parts of the tool could be made even better because you have them as a side-project, even better! (enjoyment & results).

**TL;DR** Very open, working on money projects accepted, running costs for space are totally fine, effective/efficient wuppspace. Finished wuppspace is the goal, not the process.

First ideas in Wurzen conceptual process

Fast forward a bit to the recent Wurzen talks: A pretty small group of people came together to develop a concept how such a WuppSpace - now having a different name, WuppHaus Wurzen - and we were talking about money could be handled inside the WuppHaus: The vision of the group was quite clear about that individuals should not live in the WuppSpace and have some outside fulltime activity. I am so far fine with it. But also, doing paid work was like a no go. In the end, it sounded like earning a bit of money to fulfill your personal needs, is fine (like health insurance, a bit of transport, etc.), but if you earn more than that you should be obliged to donate that to the house. There were also talks about a common economy. Both concepts have not been worked out so far but are still an idea. While that made sense to me during the talks and I was totally fine with it, I now know pretty much that I think both ideas are pretty much exclusive. They take away individual freedom, at least for me. I still imagine using the workshops for all kind of activities I did in my youthtime. I know that I - as an individual - will continue to buy ingredients for projects when I feel like it (and see a reason behind). There might be months where I spend some hundred euros on stuff. I do not want to give away that freedom, at least not until a working alternative is there. I also sometimes really like digging into other peoples projects, like working for a company for a bit. My current freelancing work allows this, a concentrated work period where I can learn a lot about a new field. I myself am not interested in the very deep core concept of unconditional sharing, but I want to enable sharing for more people (which includes promoting the concept of sharing so people learn that there is something else), want to share myself a lot. I don't want to force people to sharing and give up the life I like to live a live limited to what the concept allows me to do in each situation. But this is not only about me - I really like the creativity and spirit around hacker- and maker spaces. I can see the WuppSpace evolving into a small one, because we like to attract people and encourage relationships that can also share knowledge. I like to provide a space that is maybe not available in the area. But maybe we don't apply rules to visitors? What about maybe more permanent visitors? Nick and Alexander stated that they like working for money to use their won freedom to work on voluntary projects (like those remaining software projects that fall under the yunity umbrella) - and I would like to keep this lifestyle possible. Everybody has different needs. By forbidding practices, we exclude people and fight diversity.

**TL;DR** no paid work, common economy; I dislike because I still want to participate in consumerism for some projects (freedom, evolvement) as well as stay open (other people doing this)

WuppSpace under the name of yunity?

Still the house should have values and goals. It should be apparent that a common goal is to spread unconditional sharing. It is easy to show this with the different things that are done in the house. People should not primarily work on project that contradict values or goals. But that should not be a rule but a hint. If the community feel this valuated, it should be spoken about and conflict solving should be used. I think I never had the wish, to promote the WuppSpace as a (pure) yunity Space, although I could see it fit as a yunity project. Also, if you or I read my personal intentions for the space above, it is not necessary to do this as "yunity". It just needs some people who would like to make it true. I still feel (and hope) like a lot of the people currently in yunity might use it quite often. It is also clear to me, that I mostly follow the approach of a WuppSpace that includes my needs and I am willing to put way more money in a thing that includes me than a thing that excludes myself. That does not mean that I am not willing to participate in processes designing concepts of such a space :-)

**TL;DR** Values/goals aligned to yunity, not necessarily a yunity project but expect a lot of yunity people to participate

Is buying a house okay?

The general question of buying vs. not buying: I felt like I have found some people around who are willing to use money to buy a house. Especially when it is about a house that is to be sold anyway in an area where prices are expected to go up pretty much soon, in a condition where normal people would use approximately 30 times as much money as us to get it into a livable state again. Why should this group of people then step back, let others by the house? Only because there are people on the world, who don't have the possibility to do this? I am not able to understand this. In my opinion, no one will ever blame us for having bought a house. And yes, for sure, if a group of people buys a house and starts realising their ideas in that house inviting others later allows these others to participate in the ideas of the people. But maybe there is also some freedom left for others to step in to realize their own ideas? Maybe the space in general creates a new space of creativity and freedom? I dislike disconnecting myself from how current society works. And I might be selfish if I use measures of society to fulfill my dreams and needs. I have the strong need of a proper space for approximately half a year now and nobody so far gave it to me in an alternative way. So I called for people who like to do it with the way I can imagine. As reference, my primary personal objective as stated in the Wiki: "My main project in yunity should be the foodsharing.de website although I get distracted way too much lately. Currently, I am focussing on finding a solution for my living arrangement in the next years: A housing project that aligns to the values of yunity and implements very open spaces, communal living and allows concentrated working on different projects. I like to try and implement different concepts for daily used tools (showers, toilets, energy & water supply & usage) as well as support other yunity projects as good as possible."

**TL;DR** other people would participate in buying; I see a lot of possibilities for the space; Have strong needs for a space; no alternative concepts worked so far

Pauls questions on money

I was asked to answer Pauls questions as well:

What is money? - money is a concept that uses numbers to provide an instrument of exchange.
How is money used? - it is used to exchange lifetime/work, as well as goods and services. It is also used as a virtual exchange, that allows people handling of resources to gain advantages (or maximize their money). As money is seen as needed by a big part of humanity, it is used to suppress people for others profit
How can money be used? - I answer this as "How should money be used": As an utility that allows easy exchange of goods. It seems that society needs a measurement to equalize what people can get/have/use and money is seen as such a thing. The misuse and unfairness of wages does not seem big enough yet that the general concept is seen as bad. Society accepts, that different jobs are valued differently.
Why is money existent? Why are we using money? - I don't really know. I think it was made existent in the need of a better exchange good but it might be kept alive just by the people profiting from it, but I don't know. I personally use money because I can get most needs fulfilled with it quite easy.
What are the benefits of money? - It allows an easy global exchange. People all over the world offer you their services and belongings for money. As long as you have money and the area in which you are is kind of stable (no war,...), with money it is easy to get what you want.
How do you profit from money? - I gain access to resources which are mostly not at all or just to a very little extent available without.
What are the disadvantages? - Personally? As I never had problems with money, maybe none (on small scale) but money enables a new layer of control parallel to politics that gives power to individuals who gained it somehow. On a small scale, there are a lot of people who don't have the ability to fulfil their dreams (or even needs) because lack of money limits them (and they don't know about alternative ways)
How does money affect me? - As I see that money can always be the enabler for many things and resources, I am careful with spending money and may sometimes relax some of my values a bit when it enables me getting goods for less money (although in current economy, this is really hard to get right if right even exists). It may also be the reason why I hitchhike more than using trains.
How would you feel if you had no money and would live in ....
How would you feel if you had 1 Mrd. and would live in .... - No money in terms of zero would limit my possibilities very much. It would directly affect my daily life where I currently rely on goods that I bought (computer, head light, batteries, mobile phone contract, other small things of enjoyment/interest). Still I would say that the amount of extra money I had would not change much. In the context here, I would maybe have bought a big house fitting to the WuppHouse concepts that a group including me would have defined :-)
How does money effect society? - It encourages relationships that follow the money flow instead of interest or support. It puts people in a certain precondition by birth (with the "wealth" of their parents).
How does it effect yunity? - Imho it takes a lot of resources (man-hours) for discussions and thoughts. It touches the core concept because money is the opposite of sharing (because it is an instrument of exchange). A solution would be to have clarity on how deep connected to the core concept of sharing a thing connected to the yunity network has to be

Arno Döpper

2017-02-03

I'll start with a song stuck to my head lately (Ohrwurm): "In the name of love, once more in the name of love." Which very quickly turned to: "In the name of yunity, once more in the name of yunity." I will try to make it a short read. First of all I think I need to mention that due to the fact that compared to Paul, Matthias, Lara, Bodhi, Philipp, Zed etc. I have not been that much involved in the WuppHaus projects (yet) the magnitude of my resistances towards different approaches is comparably low. I like the idea of the house in Wurzen (and I liked the statement of Matthias a lot). And I like the idea of yunity being all about unconditional sharing. And I am very curious how the different approaches - with and (almost) without money - will develop over a longer period of time. I don't really see a point in it being a yunity project. I think TransitionHaus Wurzen would suit the purpose better. Although this scenario is funny: "WuppDays Wurzen" - yunity people staying for 'free' in the TransitionHaus Wurzen - and other (or the same) yunity people working on side projects to finance the TransitionHaus Wurzen. Just for you to know: I took over an hour to write this. Amazing. "In the name of yunity, or better not in the name of yunity?"

Nick Sellen

2017-02-05

I joined yunity about 2 weeks after the start of the first wuppdays in Malo. I had been uncertain whether to participate, my uncertainties were mostly about whether the project (which was a software project) would be well managed, were there good processes involved etc. I emailed in advanced and was not especially satisfied with the answers, but decided to go along anyway.

A good context for understanding what I was getting involved with is the original invite video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTh24fueZNI&t=14s - quite well focused and a clear intention to build a modern software platform for enabling foodsharing in Germany and around the world.

The project clearly took on a life of it's own and at this point the majority of the activity I see in yunity is now concerned with providing living solutions for the members - food, housing, community. There is an increasingly strong voice for doing these things with a moneyless approach too.

I wasn't intending to get involved in such a community but it's been very positive for me in a number of ways:

making friends with some lovely people
making connections with a wider set of people
exploring what happens when I push my personal comfort zone to the edges
learning new techniques for living a low-cost, low-resource lifestyle
getting first hand experiences of the difficulties that alternative communities face
getting connected to other projects (e.g. my new paid work is directly via yunity connections/references: yunity -> trustroots -> outlandish)
really believing/understanding deeply that my life works better if I don't plan my trajectory (a -> b -> c), but just get involved in things without understanding where they will lead (there are many things I don't know about the world and myself, and I can always be pleasantly surprised)
understanding that I have motivation and belief in the importance of working with grassroots community software projects for the longer term
much more clarity that I reject the VC-funded startup model of change

So it's not an understatement that it's been a profoundly lifechanging experience being involved - even if right now my direct yunity contributions are not so much.

I feel myself sliding away from yunity though. I already stepped back a lot from working directly on writing software to a more meta-level of contribution (some project structure stuff, assistence where I can be useful, etc) - this is something I feel I can continue at the level I am doing it for some time. But I feel this aspect of yunity is increasingly marginalised - there are only a small handful of people working on anything software related now and progress is quite tricky.

For me to move towards yunity right now it would seem to involve: less focus on owning posessions, not work on incoming-generating projects in wupphauses, dealing with people with perspectives/philosophies that I don't find compelling (more on that later), probably being around more drugs than I would like.

Right now I am moving more in a direction of earning money and exploring various coliving/coworking spaces (in Spain) - although these are usually too far in the other direction for me (too professional, too capitalist, too fancy). I am stranded in the middle.

Within yunity I often feel more like a regular society person (I have/use/earn money, I eat meat, I buy things in supermarkets/shops, I am posessive about my stuff) - but to regular society I am living quite experimentally - I am not interested in house owning, I do not hoard money for my future, I (currently) have no fixed place to stay, I barely work on commercial projects, I don't fly, usually travel by human power, I have no long term plans.

If yunity doesn't have a compelling vision for my life, then I think there is a very set narrow set of people that can become deeply involved - and if you have to turn your back on your old life then this is moving towards a cult-like community, and I am not interested in that.

One of the parts of yunity that I always felt very positive about is the openness, lack of dogma, and ability to speak your mind openly (I remember in the first wuppdays when Clemens was very uncomfortable with some of the circle activities and often strongly spoke his mind, and nobody seemed perturbed by this, he was still very welcome and not compelling to do things he was uncomfortable with - I had much more emotional clashes with him about purely software things...).

It became clear to me by some time in 2012 that my main contributing to making the world a better place should be via my computer-based skills (http://ontheroad.nicksellen.co.uk/2012/02/06/6-months-on-the-road-a-retrospective/) - it was a strong and clear realisation for me that has remained true. So on a more concrete note: the level to which yunity can support a productive software development culture is strongly correlated to my interest in the project.

So, sorry this is getting a bit long now and maybe not logically structured, but to get to the point about philsosophy - the stuff I read from paul/lara (and others maybe) about moneyless aspects is not compelling to me at all. The "yunity way" is to exist from surplus resources, but they must come from somewhere. There is no supermarket dumpster diving without the supermarket. There are no empty houses without house building. The chocolates you will get from the bin in a few weeks have not even been made yet.

I totally support living in a way such as to use the surplus food/housing/anything - most people do not want to live in that way, so there will likely always be surplus, and it should be used. In this way supermarkets and dumpster diving/foodsharing are two sides of the same coin. They exist together or not at all.

It's a huge leap to then suggest the whole world might run this way - there is no surplus without production. The skills of finding and using surplus resources are not the same skills required to produce resources. It's a fundementally different endeavor.

I would be happy if there were a fundementally different way to run the world, but I see nothing compelling inside yunity on this topic. It's not about a feeling that change is coming, it's not a short article here and there. To remake the world anew is a serious endeavor - the things to change the world might be a network of research institutions, thinktanks, academic research, politics/politicians, PR campaigns, protest movements, many books, blogs, articles, media - a whole suite of institutions working towards some kind of common vision. This book gave me quite a lot of thoughts in this direction: https://www.versobooks.com/books/1989-inventing-the-future - even if you disagree with the vision of the book, the scale of the endeavor is the same.

By this I don't mean the moneyfree experiment should stop. Sometimes you have to take an argument to it's logical extreme to shine light on a topic. But I argue to treat it like an experiment, not a new dogma - and this is not my experiment.

What I see in yunity is an increasingly inward focused community - as I said earlier, much effort going towards sustaining the housing, food, community aspects. And it turns out that even these seemingly more modest goals are hard. It might be there is a point where these things are set up nicely, and it provides a solid base for the next level of organisation - but I'm finding it harder and harder to see where I fit into this.

To try and be more positive about a direction that would revitalize it for me, a few things that I think would be very positive:

a proper decision making/authority structure in place that people use and believe in
a more detailed statement of philosophy
a clear intention to produce some outward-facing things (whether it is software, handbooks, housing, etc...)
perhaps a way to know what projects can be yunity projects, and a way people can make side projects that may just be associated with yunity - a clear concept of what associating with a yunity project is anyway
a pathway to assigning/allocating responsiblities - more serious about how to do decentralized working effectively (see some discussion with Philip in #structure about this)
a conflict resolution process

The general theme of the above is about getting serious. I don't know if the model is correct, but yunity seems to be stuck in a storming phase (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuckman%27s_stages_of_group_development).

The other option for me is to just accept how it is, define myself as outside of yunity, but remain friends - I just swing by sometimes and say hi.

(in any case none of this stuff above changes my commitment level from a software perspective - foodsharing.de or foodsaving tool)

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